From his role as drummer and co-vocalist/songwriter in legendary 1980s US hardcore genre-definers Hüsker Dü, to his time at the front of critically acclaimed post-hardcore outfit Nova Mob, to his solo albums, to being the man behind a bewildering musical interpretation of Milton's epic story-of-creation Paradise Lost, Grant Hart is anything but unfocused. Since winning a battle with heroin while simultaneously losing (a moral) one with his Hüsker Dü counterpart Bob Mould, he's been writing and touring like a maniac. As we await the release of his take on Milton's 17th-century masterpiece, we stopped him at a recent show for a few words...
Grant Hart. Photograph by Hanna Pribitzer.
What's happening tonight?
Tonight people are going to hear a wide variety of things. From old favourites to stuff from my soon-to-be-released album which I've called 'The Argument'. It's based on Paradise Lost by John Milton, but I've decided to avoid the title, because if you Google 'Paradise Lost' you're gonna find all manner of odd stuff. Whether it's heavy metal or whatever. It's a very loaded pair of words.
How do you even begin to approach this? It's a massive piece of writing.
Well, I decided very early that I was going to make no attempt to compose in order of things occurring in the Milton. By hopping around a bit I was able to make chunks of it coagulate, and then you link the chunks together. Along the line you notice when you have to become more interested in the greater work. You're gonna write what appeals the most to you, and the thing that I have noticed about other people's adaptations of Paradise Lost was that it was very concentrated in the early books of it, and then all of a sudden Adam and Eve are getting kicked out of the garden. It goes straight from the gates of hell to eating the apple from the tree.
The edited highlights.
Yeah. Of course these are interesting bits. There's a lot of material in the original that can be found elsewhere, so I didn't put a lot of emphasis on 're-writing the Old Testament'.
Are there any parallels in what Paradise Lost is about to the sentiment behind (Nova Mob's) Last Days Of Pompeii? (Long pause) They've very climactic stories. I never really gave it a great deal of thought, but... Last Days Of Pompeii doesn't really take in any elements of jealousy and forgiveness, or vindication or vengeance. Y'know? This is more emotional. Did you have to read it in school?
No, never. I only properly came to know it when I saw an illustrated version of it. Do you consider this a Grant Hart solo album?
I'm working with a couple of extra musicians, but they're more or less playing what I've chosen for them to play. It's one of the closest relationships between me and an engineer that I've ever had. I'm working with Mike Wisti who did three quarters of (Grant's previous solo album) Hot Wax.
Is that relationship a result of the success you had with Hot Wax?
A lot of times a person's actions can be compared to sleepwalking. You steer away from disasters and you don't even think of following a path that works. When you walk into a room you know where the light switch is, so you throw your hand up at that particular time. It's only when the light doesn't come on that you really give it much consideration. To draw conclusion from that, you continue doing things that work for you - you change it according to the ideas that you have, and if you have an idea to fine-tune whatever, you polish that up. Sometimes success is - and I don't mean financial success, I mean artistic success - can be defined by the absence of failure.
There aren't that many musical takes of poetry.
Pop music has got very dull. It's just a repetitive process. I was playing this for a friend of mine as we were driving up to London from Brighton and we were kind of, like, strapped for what to call it. It's not an opera, the closest thing we could define it as would be a musical. That was part of the inception of it. Something that could be staged as an entire work. I made the decision early on that I was going to avoid writing stuff that couldn't stand independently of the project, so a lot of the major songs in it have meanings elsewhere in the world, and not just in the context of the greater work.
So because the basis for the work already exists, in the form of the poem, and it's a poem that you're obviously a fan of...
Well, I - like you, and anybody that's read it in the last hundred years - was attracted to the Gustave Doré illustrations, which are very dramatic, very cataclysmic. It gives you an idea of what has been drummed into people's heads.It's up to me if I repeat it or resist it.
So which is it?
Both.
A lot of bands reform these days to play their 'best' album live. 18 year-old kids have seen Sonic Youth and the Melvins play their old songs now. What do you make of that?
There's a lot of things going on with the heads of those people. I'm disinclined to move in that direction. I could see conditions being imaginable that would make somebody want to go for that. I have new ideas that I want to give and chance, and give some time to. Not necessarily in the case of Sonic Youth or the Melvins, but there's a lot of bands out there who feel that Nirvana or Smashing Pumpkins, any of those early-to-mid nineties 'super punk' acts got all the glory that everybody worked for throughout the eighties. Y'know? I don't look at it the same, I think that there's a price that you pay for being ahead of the ballgame. Not cashing in is the result of that.
Do any of the bands who cite Hüsker Dü as an influence impress you?
The event of me hearing a song that I didn't write, and thinking to myself, "Man, I wish I would've written that one" is the closest to that that is gonna happen. When somebody says they're influenced by me, or influenced by Hüsker Dü, I shouldn't be able to hear the influence. I should just be able to hear it and go "Oh, nice song!"
Can you hear your own influence in any of Bob Mould's post-Hüsker Dü stuff?He's been quite unkind in the press.
In Bob's repertoire there are a couple of songs where I think, "Man, that's a great song", almost to the point where I wish I wrote it. I doesn't happen that frequently, but it's not impossible. What people have to realise, is that neither Bob nor I have worked with anybody for as long as we worked with each other. I think when you have a situation like that you can't really determine what people are saying when they're reflecting back on that.
Are there songs of yours you think he wishes he'd written?
Given the same conditions, it would stand to reason that it'd be possible, y'know?With Bob's psyche, and with Bob's apparent emotional injury by me, it would be the biggest surprise in the world to ever hear him admit something like that. Bob is a very sensitive writer. He explores the depths of his pain with his music, and I wish that he could put it into the words that explain to me what it is that I did to hurt him so badly.
Do you think about that much?
I'm answering questions in an interview, y'know? But that's not to say I'm not concerned with his well being. He is a very important person in my life, and I would assume that any conflict between us will eventually become meaningless to either both of us or one of us.
Do you have a release date for this record?
We're still sorting out some things. It's hard to believe that there is no UK label that will take a 'risk' on England's greatest epic poem. I'll find someone before I'm done with London!
What are your plans beyond this record?
Having experienced the situation before, where you release something that you think is pretty major, and you have to follow that with something, I've given some thought-time to the old "How am I going to follow this?" There's a few ideas that I'm investigating, but I have no need. I'm not going to be disappointed if the next record is just going to be an ordinary record. They can't all be Paradise Lost, right?
Italian-English electronic duo Walls have recently returned from a tour of America with the mighty Battles, and are enjoying some amazing press for 'Coracle', their second full-length album. Acclaimed across the board, with 'Album of the Month' accolades from everyone from Vice and NME to Mojo and the Guardian, Sam Willis and Alessio Natalizia's shimmering analogue future-dub joins the dots between Four Tet, Burial, Animal Collective and Nicolas Jaar while it blurs the boundaries between Chicago House, shoegaze and Krautrock. People are starting to wise up to Walls, thanks in part to the band's label - Cologne's impeccable Kompakt - so we spoke to Sam before they get too big to talk to people like me...
Walls. Photograph by Robert Bellamy.
How was the Battles tour? What kind of places were you playing in? Did you get to go record shopping?
It was amazing! The venues were mostly around 1000 capacity, often theatres... We got to see the Redwood Forest and Mount Rushmore. Also, getting to go to the less travelled parts of the US like Idaho, Minnesota, Ohio, Montana and so on was fascinating, the real America basically! The Battles guys have been super welcoming and friendly, we get on great together. We went to Amoeba Music in LA which is massive - we were happy to see that they'd racked out our album with a nice description! Also we went to Powell's Bookstore in Portland which was a real treat - it's huge and has an incredible selection. Such a welcoming and cosy environment. The sad thing is that it's hard to imagine a business like that getting off the ground nowadays...
What's your live set-up? How much of your studio gear can you take on tour with you?
We have a bunch of hardware - samplers, sequencers, monosynths, lots of delay pedals and mixers.. It's a real pain to travel with, but it's so much more fun when we're playing. Using a laptop was never really an option!
It hasn't taken you long to put two albums out on Kompakt. Did you have your debut ready to go when you signed? How did your deal with them come about?
Yeah, we had already composed a bunch of tracks before they asked us to do the record. Originally it was due to be an EP but we decided to expand it into a short album. It took us about six months of work. It was mostly original compositions but some older stuff was cannibalised as part of the process! We've been friends with the guys there for a while and would always talk on email. It all just happened very quickly and naturally, and when the first tracks came together they were the natural first choice for our music!
Did you get a trolley-dash of the Kompakt warehouse when you signed?
More a dash through the Kompakt archives - they have an incredible back catalogue. The GAS boxset reissue was a particularly prized acquisition, alongside some of the earlier label compilations... Things were a lot more raw and minimal in those days!
What other labels are you digging just now?
We love what our friends at Border Community do...
The new album sounds a lot more rhythmic than the first one. Is this a reflection of what you've been listening to in the last year or so?
It's more a reflection on us playing a lot of live shows to be honest. With the first record, we were really exploring where we wanted to take our collaboration. We really enjoy making people dance, but also tripping them out!
What have you been listening to anyway? Has it changed much since Alessio moved to London?
We're always discovering new stuff that excites us, of all different genres and eras. It seems crazy to us that the vast majority of people focus so strongly on the music being released now when there's so much incredible stuff out there. We've got the entire history of recorded music at our fingertips!
Can you elaborate?
Loads of individual tracks. It all depends on the time and context really. Personally I've been getting really into going back and listening to classic pop records from the 70s, just to marvel over the wonderful analogue sound. And the masterful production, joyous melodies and songwriting! Like Carly Simon's 'You're So Vain' for example - putting a song like that alongside Lady Gaga really makes you wanna weep about how music is going...
You're getting a lot of praise in the press - is it possible to continue doing what you do without paying too much attention to this?
We just carry on making music all the time regardless. We try our best not to be swayed by other people's opinions on what we do. For us to release anything, it has to be something that we both really love. We've come this far by staying true to ourselves, so that's the simple plan for the future too!
Do you see much of each other? How much of the writing is done together? Is everything recorded and mastered with the pair of you present?
We see each other pretty much every day at some point. We do quite a bit of both writing apart and together, that definitely yields different results, so it's fun to play with the process in that way.
What kind of different results? How much would it affect your music if you lived in the same house? Like The Monkees.
We'd go crazy living in the same house! we definitely enjoy our work together, but it's vital to have separate space to develop ideas, explore new possibilities with plugins and equipment that we can then bring back into the fold
You endlessly get referred to as either krautrock, shoegaze, or both. Does that offend you?
It's fine, it's pointless trying to fight against that stuff!
It's great that your LPs come packaged with the CD too. What's your thinking behind this? Most people only bother putting in a download redemption code.
That's Kompakt's idea. We're really happy about it, as it means that people can buy the vinyl and still have the CD too. We must prefer the aesthetic of the LP anyway, it's a much more pleasing format!
There's talk of the majors phasing out CD albums now. Do you think vinyl might actually outlast CDs?
Absolutely, it's just so much more of a pleasing format than a jewel case CD, although we understand that some people really treasure their CD collection... It's always going to change for successive generations, each format means something different. We grew up in the 80s, just as CD was starting to come in, so that seems somehow the more authentic medium
Where and when were you skating?
Back in the mid 90s, in the heyday of Tom Penny and Geoff Rowley, and around the Manchester gasworks area. I still love to watch the odd skate video now and then - 'Video Days' has to be a favourite!
Can you think of any videos that stand out, musically, from the past?
I'm really bad with titles, but I remember hearing Mobb Deep 'Shook Ones' for the first time via a skate video, and that was really one of the first tracks to turn me on to hip-hop properly. (BMW guesses Sam heard this on Rick Jaramillo's 'Profile' in 411 #24).
Former Thrasher photographer Nik Freitas has released five albums since leaving the magazine in 2002, toured with Bright Eyes, Grandaddy and Rilo Kiley and he still finds time to skate. His new record 'Saturday Night Underwater' is out now.
Nik Freitas.
Who, or what inspires you to create music?Do you consciously sit down to write songs?
I think the inspiration starts as a feeling, and it can happen pretty much whenever. I hate to say it, but I think the best stuff starts happening when you're feeling down and shitty about something. Or pissed off. It usually starts as a melody, withmaybe a few words. I don't really sit down and try to write a song anymore, if you do that, it usually ends up sounding forced and fake. It's been the case that for the past few years that I usually have a song written out in my head before I sit down with a guitar or at a piano, and by that point I'm just trying to figure out the chords to what I'm hearing in my head.
Do you think pro skateboarders nowadays have a different attitude to those in the 80s and 90s? What do you think of all the changes skateboarding's been through?
To be honest, I haven't really kept up with skateboarding. I've occasionally tried to check out some new videos and stuff, but that's about it. Everyone looks pretty much the same from what I've seen. Don't get me wrong, I mean, the tricks they're doing now are mind-blowing - a switch backside lipslide down a handrail is just insane. It's sick. But at the same time it almost seems robotic, like a video game. When I grew up skating, there was so much style involved. Each skater had his own way of doing tricks. Tom Knox doing a kickflip looked totally different to when Salman Agah did one. There was no 'right' way to do a trick. Any way you did it was dope. Now with all the videos and video games, everyone's kickflip looks the same. I remember it was so hard to learn a kickflip, and if you could to do a kickflip, you were super good. It took me forever to figure it out... Just trying to land one took forever! Now kids have videos on 'how' to do a kickflip. We didn't have that. A kid now learns how to do a kickfip in the first week of skating. He can barely ride down the street but knows how to do a 360 flip. It's so crazy.
Do you think modern skate videos have lost their soul? It's all about HD cameras and composed soundtracks now.
Again, I haven't really kept up with the videos, but I think a composed soundtrack to a skate video is a great idea. I'd love to do a music soundtrack for a skate video. You can't fight the progression of stuff. Music, movies, art, skate videos... It's gonna change. Maybe it loses some 'soul' along the way, but what are you gonna do? When I started, skating was dead. I was the only person that skated in my class when I graduated high school. It was such a revolutionary time period, when street skating was really starting to begin - the possibilities seemed endless - dudes were doing so much cool shit. You had to really use your imagination to come up with new stuff.
Do you think skateboarders are naturally creative people?
Totally. At least that's how it was when I was growing up skating. I got into skating for exactly that reason. I was drawn to it. The artwork, the vibe... I loved being in the streets, you see things differently and you're just part of everything around you. I remember skating for miles, just pushing for like, hours, to go skate some curbs in a parking lot. If someone asked you where you were going, they wouldn't even understand it! You weren't in a car protected from the world around. When you were on your board skating, you were in the middle of it. Regular people see a red painted curb and they think, "I can't park there", whereas when I see a red painted curb I think "5-0 grind!"
Nik Freitas
What are your favourite places in the world? Places that either skateboarding or music have taken you?
New York City. Prague. Paris. I love Europe. There are a lot of great cities in the U.S. too. I love Austin, Nashville, Athens and New Orleans.
Do you have a home-studio set up?
Heck yeah. I record all my records at home. I'm really into recording gear, the old vintage stuff. Old synthesizers. I love the way it sounds.
What pictures in skateboard magazines stood out to you?
So many! I was a big fan of Tobin Yelland's photos. His photos really captured the whole thing, not just the trick, but just everything involved in it. There was a real mood in his photographs.
Did you get into photography through skating, or vice versa?
I grew up skating, so I got into photography through that. It just seemed to co-exist to me. I took a class on the basics of photography and started taking my camera everywhere when I went skating with my friends.I tried to make my pictures look like the ones in the mags. After a few years I started sending my photos to Thrasher, and eventually they thought they were good enough, and they printed them in the magazine. I just kept at it for many years. Eventually they asked me to be on the staff. Jake Phelps was my boss.
What was the story behind Rowley socking Phelps? He's not the only person to have done it...
Oh, I didn't know about that. My friend Richard Paez socked Phelps and broke his glasses. Jake loved it, he was always down for Richard after that.
Was it hard to leave the mag?Was music at the point where it was overtaking your work at Thrasher?
I was over it. Jake knew it, I think. I wanted to play music. That's that. I remember walking into Jake's office and just sitting down and telling him that I quit. He was really cool about it. I know it sounds cheesy, but he said "If your heart isn't into it, then you shouldn't be doing it". He shook my hand and told me I was always welcome at Thrasher.
Working for Thrasher had a pretty big influence on my life. I was young, 21, 22, 23 years old... Thrasher isn't just a mag, it's the whole thing. I was proud to work and represent Thrasher. I learned how to take criticism, but also to stick by what you do. I learned that the most important thing, when you're making something, is to make sure it represents you, even if nobody gives a shit. I learned how to say "Fuck you, this is how I do this."
What about music? Did being around skateboarding help you get into music?
Yeah, all the music in the skate videos was rad. More than anything, it was the mood the music would put you in. You would skate differently depending on what you were listening to. If I was gonna skate a pool, I wanted to hear Slayer. If I was gonna skate a ledge, I'd want to hear hip-hop. If I was trying to do a line in a parking lot with like a bench, manual pad, and some stairs then I'd want to hear some punk rock or something. I really got into all styles of music early on. I played drums in the jazz band in high school too. I loved all the music in the first Stereo video, or Gonz's part in the Blind video, just cruising the streets to jazz music and killing it! The old H-Street videos too. I think the first Consolidated video had great music - Karma's section was where I first heard King Crimson.
What are you listening to at the moment?
Umm... I'm not really listening to music at the moment. I was listening to some stuff last year. The last Bright Eyes record is super good. Jenny and Johnny. The Dawes record is really good. Blake Mills made a record last year that's one of my favorites.
How did you get hooked up with Conor Oberst?
I was playing guitar on tour for my friend Jim Fairchild's band All Smiles. Jim was the guitar player in Grandaddy and was friends with a lot of people out there. Jim encouraged me to bring CDs of my own music to pass out to people, he's super cool. We played the last show of a tour in Omaha, Nebraska - I've always loved Omaha and the people there, just always a good vibe - and there was an after-party and they passed around a guitar, and I played a song. This guy Ian, who we had been hanging with the whole night, came up to me and asked if I had made records, or had a CD, so I gave him one. Ian turned out to be Conor Oberst's cousin, and he passed the CD along to him. I've since become really good friends with everyone who was at that party and of course, Conor.
You played a lot of shows in 2011. Do you get accustomed to touring life? I've been traveling in cars, vans, buses, trains and planes through either skateboarding or playing music for 15 years. It's become second nature to me.
What are your plans for 2012?Are you bringing 'Saturday Night Underwater' to Europe?
I'm not sure about 2012 yet, but I really want to get back over to Europe and play some more shows. I had a really great time playing over there this summer, the audiences were so cool and respectful. When the audience is like that, it really helps you play better, you want to give back and try to stoke people out.
Glasgow's Happy Particles operate with a healthy disregard for the conventions of music industry operations, and with some admirable inattention to the notion of self-promotion. Since his solo beginnings with the lo-fi post-shimmercore Slowness project, Steven Kane has built a six-piece band of like minds, and together this group of friends have created something quite magical - their 'Under Sleeping Waves' album exudes hopelessness as much as it does joy, and is as thoughtful and heartfelt as it is bitter and cynical. Simultaneously drawing influence from the American independent underground, contemporary classical and vintage avant garde space-rock; Happy Particles' debut is undoubtedly going to be one of the albums of 2012 - despite its considered and contrary 2011 release date. I spoke to Steven and guitarist/bassist Al Doherty about their past, present and future.
L-R James Swinburne (Rhodes piano, saxophone), Gordon Farquhar (drums, percussion), Graeme Ronald (bass), Steven Kane (guitar, vocals, laptop, piano, glockenspiel), Al Doherty (guitar, bass), Ricky Egan (guitar). The guy in the trolley is Ally McCrae, a radio presenter.
The album came out on Christmas Day. Is it intended as a gift, or is it something holy?
S: It's definitely not holy. We just though, "When is the worst time you could possibly put an album out?"
A: It was the most obtuse time, but also just seemed the best time to put it out.
S: We did argue about it a wee tiny bit at first. The thing is, we can do whatever we want because nobody's signed us, and we paid for the album ourselves and recorded it with our pal. No one's stopping us from doing anything. When's the worst time you can put an album out? Christmas Day. But actually it wasn't that bad.
It's still being talked about in terms of being a 'Best of 2012' album.
S: Aye, I think people are thinking of it as a 2012 album...
A: Again, unintentional! It is the most ridiculous time to put a record out if you feel it's even good enough to be considered for an end-of-year list. That didn't even cross my mind!
S: It didn't cross our minds until people started saying "Why have you put it out when we've already done our lists?" We didn't really thing about your lists or whatever. I had a sneaking suspicion that people would be doing fuck all. I just thought, "I bet people are still on the internet over Christmas", because they wouldn't be at work, they wouldn't be at college. I think I was right, because people were talking about it for about a week, and it was all over the internet. That wasn't planned. But it was nice.
It's the first Happy Particles album, but do you consider it an album, or is it a collection of songs you've all had in your heads for a while?
S: It's definitely an album. There are songs on the album that are only on the album because we started recording the album. A lot of the stuff didn't have strings on it until we started recording the album. And we chucked songs out too.
A: There are songs that are there that definitely weren't for that album...
S: ...that precede some of the songs that were written for the album.
A: We started recording to record an album. We didn't just do bits and bobs and put them all together. We went with the intention of making an album from start to finish.
S: It's quite varied, but that's not because it's all thrown together. We were planning on being varied. I can see why you might think it was "Let's pick the best songs from whatever style they're in", but we tried to make it as cohesive as possible.
What's the cover? Where are those clouds?.
S: That's my girlfriend's photograph. It's up in Skye, I think. Or maybe it's at her granny's house... It's completely irrelevant. It's just the sky where she lived. She had loads of them, but she took it on this camera, called a Diana, and I just liked the look of it. I gave it to (drummer) Gordon (Farquhar), and he turned it on its side. It looks better the way he's done it. It's irrelevant, because I just chose a picture my girlfriend had, but to me it's relevant because it looks like you're falling asleep out your back garden or something. It probably doesn't mean that to anybody else in the band though. Or even my girlfriend.
Is that the best place to listen to the album? In your back garden?Or where?
A: In their own minds, I think...
S: I'd say, in the dark with headphones on. But I don't really like listening to music load with loads of people. It depends how many drugs you've taken, really. Maybe you'd like to jump about dancing.
Or listen to it in a car, tearing down Sauchiehall Street on a Saturday night...
S: Actually, that's great - when we were driving back when it was completely finished, me and him were listening to it. Driving back from Dundee, and it was still light but it was getting dark, and it was all minging and cloudy, and it was good in the car. I forgot about that.
And that's not just because it was the first listen after having finished it?
S: It was good because of that, but it seemed to suit the car as well. I forgot about that. But then I can't drive.
So the best place to listen to it is in the passenger seat of a car, while somebody drives you around?
S: Exactly. In a car, as a passenger.
Unless you're very good at hiding the bad stuff, you've had nothing but praise for the album in the press.Does it make you nervous?
S: Nervous in what way? Like we're waiting for a bad one?
No, like you're now obliged to do interviews.
S: No... I'm just getting a bit wary of saying the same things over and over again, if you know what I mean? But you're doing alright, that's not happened with you. But that would be my fault anyway. I don't feel nervous because it's quite removed. How we're using the internet and all that, and we don't have a label telling us what to do, so no one's putting pressure on us.
You can't do it wrong when you're doing it on your own terms.
S: Aye. And we don't see anyone - it's kind of faceless. Apart from you. I can see you.
You've seen me before anyway. Can you imagine, in ten years time, playing the album from start to finish at an off-season holiday camp in Minehead?
A: That'd be amazing. We'd have to have some sort of horrible fall-out though. I think there's got to be a proportion of that time when people don't talk to each other, and then they come back, and do it.
What do you think of the whole ATP culture, with everybody reforming to recite albums?
A: It works. There's bands that have done it who haven't stopped. Say bands like Low, or Tortoise. They've done it.
S: Are you talking about somebody who's specifically doing an album?
Yeah, somebody who's split up, and reformed to play one album live.
S: People have to make money. And that's it.
A: It sort of depends on your vision of who the band are, you know? If it's somebody you're not really into, you're going to think they're just doing it for the money. But if it's somebody like Codeine, you think it's amazing...
"They're doing this for me!"
A: Yeah! I suppose it's a fan thing, really.If the people who are watching it get that feeling, then it's a success.
Steven, you've done solo stuff for a long time. How did the album come about?Did you decide you needed a full band?
S: The album wasn't there before the band. There were songs on the album that existed, but the whole album didn't exist before the band. I didn't get a band together to do an album. I formed a band to play gigs, and we only had a handful of songs, and then other songs kind of popped out of that, to the point where there was enough songs to do an album. It was the band before the album. We didn't even think about the album 'til at least a year, maybe more, after we started.
When was that point, when you realised you could do an album?
S: I can't remember!
A: I suppose it was a personal thing for you (Steven), I don't think we ever really thought... We were in a band before we ever thought that it was the thing to do - you know, what you do is, you make an album. It wasn't this project that had to be completed or something.
S: It became that, but I can't remember when that happened.
A: I don't think you ever really set out to do that in the first place.
S: No. Basically we were trying to do gigs that were quite intense or whatever, and we weren't thinking about an album. I don't know when it happened, but at some point we spoke to Gordon - it was Gordon's pal Robin (Sutherland) that recorded the album - and he said that we might be able to get some time with Robin to record. Not an album, just anything. And we must have clicked then that we had enough songs, because after we started going up there, that was all we were thinking about. So it became this thing that took over a year of our lives, because we were doing it on the cheap and when we could fit it in. So we were going there once a month, or whatever. But I really can't remember when we decided to record an album now. It's weird, having been so obsessed by it.
It always seemed like you were quite private with your music when you were working on your own. You didn't do much with it.
S: That was because I was pretty much waiting for them to get their act together and join the band. We were talking through emails, and bumping into each other in the pub. It was me and him separately, and me and Gordon separately. Graeme and James came from Remember Remember, so it was me and Al talking about it over a couple of years. That stuff was up on the internet as demos, and I was patiently waiting for them to hurry up and come and play in a room with me. I wasn't being mega-private, I was just waiting for the rest of the band to get their fingers out! Haha!
People can either buy the album, or just listen to it, on bandcamp. Why did you put the whole thing up?
S: Just because there's no point in not. You can just as easily nick it. If you treat people with respect, then they might give you money. Or they might not. I don't know. It's that thing about not treating someone like a thief.
A: If you're thinking about media upload sites, there's an embedded thing that you can do where you can just put the thing there, and you can have a review of the album, so as immediately as you can read it you can press play and listen to it. The streaming thing's brilliant. In the end it wasn't that obtuse to release an album on Christmas Day because you could just listen to it. Everyone's connected to the internet.
S: It wouldn't have worked if we couldn't have streamed it.
Where did you record it?
A: Our friend Robin had just built a studio... He called it a barn but I think it was actually a stable conversion at some guy's house. The first time we went up, it was still in the process of getting finished, I think, and we were one of the first people to come in and try it out. It's just by Dundee.
S: Out in the middle of nowhere. Fields, and things.
Did your listening habits change over the recording of the album?
A: It was over such a long period of time. I think albums have a feel to them when they're recorded quickly, and albums that are thought about have a feel to them - they go through movements in small amounts of time, rather than just being a collection of influences. If something was recorded in three weeks, and all of yous were listening to the same five or six albums, it'd have a different feel to it. I suppose with the strings we were all listening to a load of contemporary classic, but we were listening to that anyway.
S: I don't think the album made us listen to anything different. I think I might have started listening to different stuff anyway, over the year. More jazz, probably.
It's always jazz.
S: Aye. I've listened to jazz for years though. I've been a saddo for years. I think I just listened to more jazz. We used to listen to... In the car going up - what was the record?
A: Miles Davis.
S: 'In a Silent Way'. We used to listen to that in the car on the way up quite a lot.
A: It was a journey every time we went up to add a little bit to it. In the morning we'd pick up everybody in the car, then two hours in the car up to the barn, and then we're usually coming home about twelve o'clock at night, knackered. On the way home you'd really get the vibe of it.
(My phone rings, and I leave to take the call. I think I've switched off my recorder, but it turns out I have not)
S: (nervously) That's still on. We can't say anything now.
A: We'll sit in silence.
S: Or give away our secrets.
A: Or how inane we usually are.
S: Our plans for debauchery on a Thursday night... We really can't say anything.
A: It's all a ruse, to get your darkest secrets.
S: That'd be a great idea...
A: ...interview bands, and then just disappear.
S: I bet a lot of bands would just not think about it. They'd think "Oh, he's switched it off". Because it's just on the table, you don't really suspect it'd still be running.
(I return)
Shit, this is still on...
S: We were talking about that. Wondering if it was a ruse.
Ha! Right, sorry about that. So, you've got a track called 'Classes in Silence (for Jess)'. Who is Jess?
S: That's actually my friend's mother, who passed away a couple of years ago. She was really nice to me when I was a teenager. I used to stay at his bit and she would be all nice and take care of me. And she passed away a couple of years ago, and I put her name on that song. That's what that is.
How is the writing shared out? A solo project is now a six-piece band.
S: I used to write the songs as demos, and I'll bring them in, and they'll finish parts of them. That's the way it's been going so far. But I didn't really write the strings, I just kind of 'guided' it. James (Swinburne) and Graeme (Ronald) wrote separately for that. In the future, other people's demos will probably be adapted, rather than just my demos be adapted. It's a very collaborative thing. It's quite a weird collage, and the album's quite like that as well, because everyone's personalities are blurred all over it now.
A: Things get transformed - for the better - into things that are completely different. Even things like 'Aerials', the first song on the album, that's now morphed into something completely different.
S: Aye, the first song wasn't even a song, it was just me singing, and a drone. Now it's a song with two keyboard parts, and a guitar part, and a bass part, and I wrote none of it. Apart from the vocal line and the chord progression. So that was pretty collaborative! But that's not what's on the album. We do everything a bit arse-backwards.
You don't play live very often.
S: We don't.
Why not? Is it hard?
S: It is hard to play live. It's hard to play live and be good. But also, it's hard to play live all the time, and not be shit. Especially if the songs are quite intense. Or if they're intense to you. You've got to make it intense. You can't saturate people. You know what it's like, someone gets their family and their pals to their gig every month, and a few months in you're absolutely tired. You don't want to hear them ever again. It's a mixture of trying to keep it intense and make it a bit special, so people have something to look forward to, rather than get bored of.
A: Think of a touring band, or someone that's releasing regular albums. You maybe get to see them in Glasgow once, or twice, a year, and it's amazing. Somebody like Earth can consistently do the rounds.
I've stopped going to see Earth, I think they play too much.
A: I still go. They change bits about. It depends on what members are there. But I suppose with us... When did we play live last?
S: That planetarium gig. I'm saying it has to be good, and not to saturate it, but also, we've not played out of Glasgow. So I don't think you should do that many gigs in the same city, over and over again. Maybe if we did a tour we'd lay more gigs. Maybe that's a factor as well.
Are you planning a tour?
S: Not at the moment!
Have you got any gigs coming up?
S: A gig on the 31st of March. And we're going to do a gig with a string quartet. We just need to figure that out, but it'll happen before summer. Maybe. It's got to be in a decent location. It's got be a somewhere that isn't a circuit gig, and it's going to have a string quartet. And maybe visuals and stuff. But we're doing a 'rock' show in March! Haha!
You seem to have sold quite a lot of digital copies of the album.
S: Well, we've made enough to fund another album. It took us about a month to get the money to record another album. So to me, that's success. If you can release an album, and a month later it's paid for the next one, to me that's success. But we haven't sold thousands and thousands. Because we don't have a publicist, we don't have a label, and we've got a narrow field of people who know us. Although that's getting bigger because of the internet.
Do you think you subconsciously hoped it would grow like that, organically?
S: Probably. If you're taking that attitude, then you can't start greeting about not having all these magazines call you up, and not being on telly or whatever. It doesn't really sit with the same philosophy. We were prepared for that.
A: I think we've been part of this circuit, this game, enough to know what happens and to know why people are in magazines or why they're not. We realised that it's just up to ourselves, and that's why we're surprised with these pockets of people that appear, like an album review from Belgium, and Mexican articles...
A review from California posted on Christmas Day...
A: Yeah.
S: We don't expect anything. So if anything comes up, we're like "Wow! Somebody's asking us to do something!" Like this. I think that's maybe the problem with some other people in bands, they expect so much, and it's unrealistic. And why do you need that much anyway? A lot of it's a bit pointless. The ego-stroking stuff.
Right, I'm going to say some words, and you can discuss them.
S: Ok. That's cool. I like that.
Based on things that have been written about you recently.
S: Haha! Ok.
A: Ha!
Discuss 'ethereal'.
S: I've no idea what that means. I think it means 'when someone's got a falsetto'.
A: I think that means 'whenever you put Steven's vocals through a pedal'. Haha!
S: It's something you can take the piss out of, but I can totally understand what people mean when they say it. It's just a word people clutch when they're trying to find a description...
A: It's a good word that conjures images in your head, and with associations with other bands who have been termed that, you can almost get a grasp of what they mean. When you read what's been written about us, then put the record on, you'd probably not be surprised at what you hear.
S: The only problem I've got with the word 'ethereal', is that it's got connotations with music that's either quite over-emotive or religious, but I think the vocals and the lyrics on this album are extremely cold, and dead inside. Haha! So that's the only problem I've got with 'ethereal'. It's far too positive a word!
The next one is two words. 'Sigur Ros'.
S: They don't interest me at all. The first album's alright. It's not even that good. It's fine. Coffee Table. I'm sure some people think we're Coffee Table though. It's just your...
Perception.
S: Exactly.
I think you sound more like Galaxie 500.
S: That's nice. They were more dead-inside. A bit of reverb, and a bit of deadness. I like Galaxie 500. They're quite minimal as well.
A: I think our songs, although constructed minimally, are a bit...
S: More colourful?
A: well there's six of us and there was three of them...
S: I'm quite happy with that comparison.
What about Stars of the Lid?
S: Ah, I really like them. But I'd rather discuss, have you heard (new project from SOTL's Adam Wiltzie) Winged Victory for the Sullen?
Yeah, but only recently.
S: I love Stars of the Lid. Do you like Stars of the Lid? I think they're just one of the most important bands of the last, like, fifty years or something. They're really important to me. But I like the new record that Adam Wiltzie's done, it's totally blowing my mind right now.
A: Yeah, it's incredible.
S: They played Oran Mor in January, and we didn't get to go. I saw Stars of the Lid twice. Remember Remember were supporting them before I was in Remember Remember, in Glasgow and Dundee, so I saw them twice. And it was fucking amazing.
Are there any bands in Glasgow's musical lineage you think people neglected?Like Sputniks Down.
S: I don't think Sputniks Down were neglected, I think they just stopped being a band so long ago. There are bands that are neglected though... Alec Cheer! Do you know that guy?
Yep.
S: He's neglected because he's a total genius, and he's put out five or six albums, basically for free, over the last five years, and they're as good as anything John Fahey has put out. So he's definitely been neglected. He's like a ghost, almost.
A: There's a lot of bands, unashamedly our friends bands, who are about to put out their first record, who have been kicking about for years. Like Olympic Swimmers.
S: They're a great band.
Did they not get Steve Albini to do their record?
S: No. Iain Cook. Same thing! Basically. So many bands in Scotland have done that though, so that's probably why you're getting confused. So many bands go over and get Albini to do their record, because he's affordable.
A: Mclusky did that.
S: I thought they were Welsh?
I think they are.
S: Who else... Pioneers of Anaesthetic. Steven's worked with us, and he's just put a wee album out. He's been doing it for a few years. He's under-appreciated, especially that new album he put out on bandcamp, which he picked from songs he'd done in one take. Not live, but he'd just done them in an hour or something, and that was them finished. Quality Control, it's called. The melodies in it are just mad, and beautiful. Ganger, they were under-appreciated, I believe. Their record's amazing, but they're ancient. I don't know if that's applicable any more.
What are the plans for Happy Particles in 2012?
S: We've got that string quartet gig, and we're writing a new album. We've probably got thirty half-songs. We need to start figuring out what the new album's going to be like. So I think there'll be a second album ready to get recorded by the end of the year. If we can do some string quartet gigs and have an album ready to record by the end of the year, then that'll be pretty good for us.
Is the pressure on for your second album?
S: Nah. I don't really give a shit. It'll be what it'll be. I don't know what it'll be yet.
A: I think we've got an idea of what we want a good few things to sound like. The relief of getting our album done, and now not rehearsing songs in order to play a gig, has kind of freed us up a wee bit. We're just going to start going back to the rehearsal studio and turning up the guitars.
S: One thing I would say, is that our first album - our album - is quite varied, and I think that the next album we do will be more specifically one part of that album. An element of that album will be more broadly represented as another album.
Do you know which element that'll be?
S: Well, I've kind of got an idea, but you don't know, because then you look an absolute fool if...
A: I think our interpretation of what we want becomes something else anyway.
S: Yeah. Because if I told you what I thought our first album was going to sound like, it would probably just have been quite indie-rock fare, and it ended up being infused with neo-classical stuff and all that. We're quite open to stuff, but there'll definitely be less elements than the first one, but brought out more. Maybe not just one element, but not as many. There was quite a lot of shit going on in the first one. I think anyway.
You can (and should) buy 'Under Sleeping Waves'here.
Frànçois and the Atlas Mountains recently became Domino's first Gallic signings, and it's a pairing that seems to be long overdue - the band's indie-afro-funk-pop charms sit perfectly amidst the likes of Robert Wyatt, Animal Collective and The Magnetic Fields on Domino's inimitable roster.
Since moving to Bristol (with just a trumpet and a desire to play music), Frànçois Marry has effortlessly endeared himself, and his music, to the thinking-person's indie underground. A stint in Camera Obscura and a record released on Fence ought to be enough to convince you of that, regardless of the contract the band have just signed, and the hugely successful tour they've just completed.
I spoke to Frànçois on the final night of this tour, and in-between the background noise and signal problems, we had the following conversation...
Frànçois (left) and the Atlas Mountains. Photograph by Lola Prestowski
Who are the Atlas Mountains?
At the moment, it's an English drummer called Rob Hunter - I met him in Bristol - there's a Scottish keyboard player and singer - I met him in Fife, when I was touring - and there's two other French guys, called Amaury Ranger - he plays bass and saxophone - and there's another guy called Pierre. I met him in Bordeaux. I am Fránçois, and I am French, and I live in the UK. I have lived in Bristol for six years. We're touring the UK at the moment. It's the first tour we've done with the record out.
How has the tour been? It's probably the first time most of the audience have seen you.
It's been really good. It's good timing because there's been a lot of radio play for the songs. It's been quite busy every night. We've played in Glasgow, London, Bristol, Brighton, Liverpool, Manchester... It's been busy everywhere and we're playing the new songs, to get ourselves excited.
Are you playing any of your old songs?
No. Maybe just a couple. We played 'Royan' (from 2009), and one of the songs that was on Fence Records.
Do you think you would have still signed to Domino if you lived in France?
I live in France at the moment, but I would never have signed to Domino if I had never been to Bristol. My album came to them by way of Fence Records, and I met the people from Fence Records when I was living in Bristol.
You lived in Glasgow too, didn't you?
Yes, for six years.
Woah, really?
No, sorry! Six months. Months.
You like a lot of the music from around here, don't you?
Yeah, there are a lot of bands I really love from Glasgow, like The Pastels and International Airport. I really like anything that Geographic put out. I really like Camera Obscura. I played with them for a while. I really like Bill Wells. There's lots of stuff. The people there are quite relaxed, but at the same time it's modern music. They really keep up to date with modern music and modern sound in Glasgow,but it's a city that manages to be quite laid-back and down to earth about it.
As a French guy who loves Glasgow music and lived in Bristol, where does the African sound in your music come from?
There are a lot of African music festivals in France, and when you go to the library in France there's a lot about African culture, about African life, about African music. There's a lot of connection between Africa and France because of the colonial past. And obviously, musically, it's one of the most interesting musics because it's so strong rhythmically. It doesn't seem elaborate when you hear it from the outside, it can sound like dance music or like pop music, but actually there's lots of subtleties in the playing. And the way it sounds magical, when it's done with very simple instruments. It can sound very transcendental, very spiritual.
Am I right that you recorded the new record in a church?Why did you do that?
It wasn't really part of the process really, it's actually a community centre. Like a town hall type of thing. It was just one space that was available in Saintes, where we're from. It's been declared by the city as a sort of residency space for musicians. It was the most simple, and most available place to work in.
Tell me about what you were listening to when you were making the album. I've read that you were listening to Soundway stuff, which I can hear in it, but also Aphex Twin?
Well, I'm not really attached to any genre of music, but I really like when you can feel the artistbehind the music has been trying to explore a new territory, sonically. Via sound.It doesn't matter if it's Aphex Twin, or if it's Pictish Trail doing folk music. I like when you feel that the musician behind it is looking for something other-worldly.
You've been getting a lot of good press, and loads of radio play since the record came out. Is it hard work now, or just more fun?
It's not more fun, actually. It's just the same amount of fun. It feels like it's changing, and it's always a good sign when things aren't staying the same. I'm the type of person who gets bored really quickly, and I'm really pleased that we have more excitement and more people coming to see us. If we didn't, it would feel exactly the same as it did five years ago. It is fun because it's changing, but it's also a lot of work. There's more things to organise and more people involved... Just different I guess.
What are your plans for 2012?
It's going to be a big year, we're mostly touring. We're doing a German tour in February, then we're touring France in March, and there's a big London show - in Cargo - scheduled for April as well. Then the summer festivals, and all that kind of thing. But I really want to carry on finding new songs, or new ways to play the songs we have. Trying different musical ideas inside the band, but also maybe trying to collaborate with some people on side-projects. Can you hear me?
What?
I'm in a cafe and I can't get out, because my phone is plugged in the wall. Can you hear me?
That's better.
Ok. Everything is going so well that I'm just happy to go along with it!
Did you ever skateboard?
Yeah! From the ages of eleven to about seventeen I pretty much spent most of my time outside skateboarding. It was a big part of my teenage years.
That was a good time for skateboard videos.
Yeah, yeah! There was the Plan B video, Questionable, and the 101 videos... Mark Gonzales and Ed Templeton too, I really loved those guys. And I really loved Slap magazine. There was always a bit of painting, a bit of illustration and things about music in it. I was very much influenced by the more gentle side of skateboarding. I wasn't much of a Thrasher fan. More of a Slap fan.
Cool. Do you get much of a chance to go record shopping when you're on tour?
We don't have much time. I spend a lot of my time downloading stuff from Analog Africa, of Awesome Tapes From Africa. But in terms of records, recently I've bought Ducktails, the album of the guy from Real Estate.
Matthew Mondanile.
Yeah, Matthew from Real Estate.It's really nice. And also a Robert Wyatt compilation...
You're on Domino! You should get your Robert Wyatt stuff for free.
Haha! Well, we can't get everything for free. And it's quite good to support people. We've been quite liking the new R&B sound, stuff like The Weeknd, and Drake. Hmmm... I'm sitting next to my friend and I don't think he really likes that stuff.
As singer/guitarist with Peel-favourites Hefner, Darren Hayman cemented his position as one of the leading lights of British indie-pop-folk songwriting at the turn of the century. The band's four albums on the Too Pure label led to adoring praise from listeners and musicians the world over, and although band split in 2002, Darren's subsequent solo work is attracting just as much acclaim. His seventh record, January Songs was recorded - one song a day, each with a video to accompany it - in Jaunary of 2011 (with a little input from some friends), and the limited physical release is out now.
Did you really write and record January Songs in one month?
I really did. There were two things that might be considered a cheat. The chorus to 'I Hung The Monkey' was something I'd had in my head, and I remember singing part of it to Dave Tattersall and I remember him saying he liked it, so I sort of had that in mind for the Wave Pictures. But I still had to write the verse, and structure it all, and make it into a song. The other cheat was on a day when I made some music with Mark Brend, and Mark Brend said "I'd love to do some music with you, but there's no way I could do a song in a day". So what we decided to do there, was that he made the music. So for all I know he might have spent three months on the music. I think he spent a few days or a week or something on the music, but the idea then - to try and keep it true to the idea - was that I didn't listen to the track 'til the day, and so on that day I had to write the lyric for it and record it, so it still felt like I was doing all my work in a day. So apart from that, it was all done in a month. There would be no point in not doing it, really. If you set yourself the challenge... How can you cheat when it's a competition with yourself? What would the point be? It'd be pointless. The whole thing was about me being interested in what I would do, so I had to stick to it.
So you wrote and recorded the album in January of 2011. Did this herald the beginning of your most productive year, musically? It seems like you did a lot last year.
I think that, in some ways, it felt like I didn't make that much music last year actually! It felt like I released a lot. I think there's been years where I've written more songs, and I think 2011 was more about me trying to clear a backlog. January Songs was that in itself, in that creativity can be quite quick for me, it's not always quick - I can spend a couple of years on a song sometimes - but sometimes you do something so quickly, and you're so excited by it. You have a great day in the studio, and you want to turn around and show people instantly. Sometimes the problem with the release process is that by the time you've got something out, you're already on to the next thing.
So 2011 was about releasing things, and particularly January Songs, where I hoped to, hopefully, pass on the excitement of making things quickly, and them being finished quickly.
Is January Songs an album, or is it a compilation? A compilation of your thoughts over a month, maybe?
Yeah. That's a good question, I like that question. It doesn't really feel like an album to me, and I find myself wondering if I did the right thing by deciding to release it (physically). It's a silly thing to say when I'm doing an interview to promote it, but I'm a little bit unsure whether that was absolutely the right thing to do. It was people asking, and people persuading me to, that made me do it. It felt like the point of it existed within those thirty days, and it seemed like it was something that was very suited to the internet, very suited to uploading and downloading. Something that couldn't be done previously, due to us not having internet.
Ok, I see.
Or even certain sites becoming available in the last few years, like Vimeo and Soundcloud and Bandcamp. Even though we've had the internet for... How long have we had the internet for? Thirty years? Twenty years? So no, it doesn't actually feel like an album. Perhaps it's starting to now, since I've been doing these shows. There doesn't seem to be a theme linking it other than the process. But I'd still like people who buy the record to go online and look at all the video diaries and stuff. That seems to me to be a big part of it.
Do you think your idea to hand-draw 1,500 sleeves helped you make up your mind about releasing it?
Yeah, absolutely. Because I think, a lot of people's idea - and a couple of labels that approached me about it - their idea was to make it very lavish, the idea was to have a DVD and a book with pictures. And that seemed to not fit with the spirit of the project. One review I got of it was a fair review, but it wasn't particularly glowing, because it was saying that the idea was better than the actuality. I think that's fair, but it's also my fault for releasing it, because now that I've released it I'm asking for it to be viewed next to an album that I might have... Do you understand what I'm trying to say?
Yeah, it's now a real Darren Hayman album, for sale in shops.
But it is only concept. It's all concept. It's not necessarily quality, it's whether you like the idea of it or not. So consequently, I wanted the release itself to be conceptual, and in some ways reflect this theme of hard work. I'm still really pleased with that idea actually, so that's definitely the idea that made me release it. I thought that idea was very funny. Very silly.
When I heard of this idea, I expected it to be squiggles, but it's far from it.
Well, they're not all good! Like the songs! When I was doing the songs, one rule that I didn't necessarily make public, was that all the songs must be something that your mother, or my mother, would call a 'song'. In that I couldn't necessarily do 'soundscapes', you know? Or odd art experimental music. Not saying they're not songs - I love that music too - but it had to have rules, and so it had to be something that anyone would recognise as a song. With a verse and a chorus. A traditional song. So likewise, I felt that the pictures had to be that way. I couldn't throw a bucket of paint across 50 sleeves. They had to be recognisable drawings, which I guess is an experiment of constraint, making me more conservative, but there you go.
Today is supposed to be 'Blue Monday', the most depressing day of the year. Did you write the songs with each day in mind, or did you come up with stuff one day that you used another day?
The Blue Monday thing is a complete fabrication. I was reading about this yesterday, it was invented about three or four years ago. What was the company...
I think it was a travel agent.
Right, yeah. Umm... What do you mean? Do you mean "Was it a blank page every day?"
Yeah, exactly.
No. I suppose in that sense it's a bit album-like. I was still thinking of it as a sequence, so I'd be thinking about how it would contrast, so if I'd done a run of fast songs I'd be thinking about that, and there was a desire to not repeat myself so as it got towards the end I did start doing things like spoken word, and I did an acappella song. So I think I wanted the fatigue, and the desperation, and the difficulty of it to increase, to make it more interesting.
The first few days were definitely easier, although actually the last few days weren't necessarily the hardest. The hardest bit was actually just about a week in. Days five, six and seven were really hard for some reason. Then I guess I found the rhythm after that.
What are you listening to just now?
Literally, what was on the computer as I came off to answer the phone, was Guided By Voices. It wasn't the new one, I know they've released a new one - it was Alien Lanes. It the Alien Lanes line-up that's reformed, isn't it? I like that album a lot. But in general, I've been listening to quite a lot of jazz, which I didn't think would ever happen to me. But I think it happens to everybody. Or every man, anyway, at a certain age.
I heard you've been listening to a lot of stuff on ECM lately. I suppose if you're listening to jazz, you might as well get right into it with some ECM.
Yeah, I kind of bypassed the easy stuff, really. Straight away I was kind of drawn to things like later John Coltrane, or Ornette Coleman. I always used to sort of resent it, because I thought of it as an egotistical music. On one level it is, I suppose, with all the solos, but now it almost feels the opposite. It almost seems 'egoless'. Because everyone solos all the time, there seem to be no rules, almost the opposite. It seems incredibly collaborative, and it seems a music where the bass player is definitely as important as the pianist or the saxophonist. That's kind of what I've been thinking about as I listen to it - that actually now, rock seems much more about the ego than jazz. And that's not what I used to think.
What's been happening with your live shows? Was it half the album last week and half next week? Is that right?
I didn't play absolutely everything (from the first half), I did about twelve or thirteen from the first fifteen, and I'll do the same next time. I felt that for the audience's good it just need a little editing, you know? There were a few there that they could do without, so I took it upon myself to at least make it a comfortable set length! Fifteen or sixteen songs is just a bit too long for a set.
Do you think playing it live bookends the whole thing for you? You made it in January of last year, and now you're closing the book on it by actually playing it live.
Yeah. I'm keen to move on from this one. Like I say, the idea was originally to stop the bottleneck, but what it's done is put another record in the release schedule. So I do feel that I want to draw a line under it, so I'm thinking that I won't play those songs in my regular set. It's not that I'm not fond of it - in fact I'm really, really pleased I had the idea, I've got no regrets about doing it - but I just like that the idea of it having this little separate life, like 'that funny thing he did once'. So I might retire the songs at the end of January.
What are your plans for 2012 then?
I have an album coming out in the spring, called Lido, which is my first instrumental album. It's not jazz! But maybe that taste informs it a little bit... There was a certain looseness in my approach to it. I would never say it was jazz.
But if somebody called it jazz, would you be disappointed?
I think I would actually. I think I'd say "You don't know what you're talking about!" But you can never tell how these things seep through, how things things influence you, can you? If you're listening to that much of something then it must make some impression on what you do. I make instrumental music a lot, and it's the first time I've had the guts to release it.
